New Content - Implemented Familiar equipment auto-switching in Beecore

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Nifft

Member
Since we cannot set a USER-DEFINED pref (yet?) for the Beeosity value that the maximizer uses, can there be a way made to not auto-switch in familiar equipment with B's [ittah bittah hookah for example]?

Code: 
Taking Gonald the Hovering Sombrero out of terrarium...
ittah bittah hookah is better than (none).  Switching items...
Putting on ittah bittah hookah...
Equipment changed.

thanks,
~ Nifft

PS: Ignoring the fact the ASH script was trying a hovering somBrero in this case... that's something for me to fix. I get the same output for familiar's with no B's.
 
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N

Nifft

Member
The auto-switching happens outside the maximizer when you switch a familiar out. I was -guessing- that when/if a pref arrives to give us a way of specifying our desired level w/o passing in a Beeosity param every time, that that value would be shared/used by the auto-switch mechanism to avoid increasing our B's any further if we've already hit the number in the pref.
 
Bale

Bale

Minion
I assumed that you were simply confused about terminology since the maximizer has NO preference settings. Nil, zip, none. Why should this be the first?

I sense that communication is not happening.
 
N

Nifft

Member
Quoting JasonHarper:

"5b is in progress - but the question is, what should the default Maximum Beeosity be? Zero? Unlimited? 2 or so? I was thinking of adding a defaultBeeosity pref, so you don't have to retype it for each maximization, but I'd still need to know what to set its default value to. "
Click to expand...

Wasn't me making it up - it was on the table... :)

thanks,
~ Nifft
 
Bale

Bale

Minion
Well he did not add the preference. He did however set a default value of 2 which will be used if you do not add a weight to the beeosity parameter.

If you "maximize moxie, beeosity" it will use a maximum value of 2 for beeosity.
 
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Nifft

Member
I know how the maximizer works for beeosity. I'm not talking about the maximizer and equipment. Yes, I know 2 is the current default setting, but somewhere [which I've not yet managed to find, perhaps it's under the SVN commit thread not in the Bugs]... that he was still thinking about a USER pref but could not achieve it yet.

I mentioned the maximizer ONLY in regard to the possible pref that Jason mentioned as it would be useful for the familiar auto-switching. Can we please stop focusing on the maximizer and discuss the familiar switching? ;)

~ Nifft
 
Theraze

Theraze

Active member
Nifft said:
that he was still thinking about a USER pref but could not achieve it yet.
Click to expand...

I think this is a fallacy... I believe he chose not to implement this because it'd basically be a wasted preference for 90% of the people, and that if you're waiting for it, you'll be waiting for a very long time. It's not that he COULD NOT achieve it. It's that he chose not to achieve it.

But as Bale said, you asked for a way to control it when a way already exists... you are just choosing not to use it. And while that's your choice, it doesn't mean that the capacity doesn't exist.
 
Veracity

Veracity

Developer
Staff member
This request has nothing to do with the maximizer. As Bale pointed out, automatic familiar item switching occurs whenever you switch familiars, the new familiar is not already equipped, and you have a "suitable" generic familiar item in inventory. The list of "suitable" generic items is hardcoded and hasn't changed since long before Beecore rolled out.

The interesting thing (to me) is that none of those generic items is something you can get in-run (well, except for a lead necklace) except by intentionally pulling it in a softcore run. Beecore drops when you free the king. You have a hookah in inventory and you've not freed the king yet? You intentionally pulled it.

I recently finished a series of 10 Softcore Beecore runs - my first Softcore runs ever since ascension (except for one misclick early on when I failed to select Hardcore). On my first run, I was so proud of myself: I pulled a hookah so that ALL my familiars would be boosted!

It took 1 battle before I realized my error. It took about 5 battles before I realized that I just didn't want to deal with it and closeted the hookah.

I see 3 possible responses:

1) If you have a hookah (or other generic B familiar-items - mayfly bait, box of fireworks, ...) in Softcore Beecore, it is because you intentionally pulled it. You do not accidentally have generic familiar equipment in Beecore that KoLmafia will automatically switch for you. You pulled it and thereby made it available.

If you pulled it, you intended to use it - and KoLmafia will oblige. You don't want to use it? Put it in your closet - and think harder next time before you pull it.

Which is to say, the status quo.

2) Simply filter out B items when considering automatic familiar item switching in Beecore. No maximum Beeosity. No preferences. No maximizer.

3) You want a preference? OK - enable or disable automatic familiar item switching. People have been complaining about it for years, but either we got it working well enough or they have given up in exhaustion. Our former attitude was "more preferences = more confusion" and resisted adding preferences for every little detail of operation. We've relaxed that attitude since.

I'm inclined to go with #1 and say "if you have a hookah or other generic B-item in a Softcore run, you intentionally pulled it and it is fair game."
 
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S

slyz

Developer
There is also the case where someone breaks Ronin.

I also wouldn't want to adventure with my mimic or hipster without their specific equipment.
 
Veracity

Veracity

Developer
Staff member
They broke Ronin and have unlimited pulls - and they chose to pull this item. With unlimited pulls, they can simply pull and equip the specific familiar equipment. If your familiar is already equipped, KoLmafia will not automatically swap something else in.
 
N

Nifft

Member
I think this is a fallacy... I believe he chose not to implement this because it'd basically be a wasted preference for 90% of the people, and that if you're waiting for it, you'll be waiting for a very long time. It's not that he COULD NOT achieve it. It's that he chose not to achieve it.
Click to expand...

What he actually said...

9474: Maximizer beeosity keyword should be fully working now. Default remains 2, and no pref for overriding this has been created yet, since I wouldn't be able to change its initial value later. Very amazingly untested.
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"has been created yet..." so YES, I was holding out hope for it. :)

But as Bale said, you asked for a way to control it when a way already exists... you are just choosing not to use it. And while that's your choice, it doesn't mean that the capacity doesn't exist.
Click to expand...

Please enlighten me... where did Bale provide enlightenment in regard to the familiar equpment swapping issue? I've scanned the thread twice and only see references to the maximizer until Veracity's post provides some options.

1) If you have a hookah (or other generic B familiar-items - mayfly bait, box of fireworks, ...) in Softcore Beecore, it is because you intentionally pulled it. You do not accidentally have generic familiar equipment in Beecore that KoLmafia will automatically switch for you. You pulled it and thereby made it available.
Click to expand...

Guilty. I did finish ronin as usual and before Beecore, the Pull All button has never been an issue in the scripts. Since the once-a-day pull item Bees issue was fixed to help the Pull All people not get those errors, this seemed similiar enough in scope that it was worth asking about.

3) You want a preference? OK - enable or disable automatic familiar item switching. People have been complaining about it for years, but either we got it working well enough or they have given up in exhaustion. Our former attitude was "more preferences = more confusion" and resisted adding preferences for every little detail of operation. We've relaxed that attitude since.
Click to expand...

People in my clan seem to be in the "gave up in exhaustion" group as they've been around longer than me and have stopped waiting for it, I think, heh.

Thanks all, for the feedback. Sounds like I'll be closeting until this run is done. :p

I really would like to know what Bale/Theraze thought they were making clear earlier in the day, though so I can have my DOH! moment and move on, hehe.

thanks!
~ Nifft
 
Theraze

Theraze

Active member
1) You're talking about wanting a preference for the maximizer as your eventual dream-goal.
2) The automatic swapping of familiar-gear has nothing to do with the maximizer.
3) As Bale said, the capacity to control the maximizer already exists.

Conclusion: As the capacity to control the maximizer already exists, and wouldn't solve the problem you're mentioning and causing by pulling from storage, one can only assume that you're choosing not to employ the functionality that already exists to make some sort of point.
 
Veracity

Veracity

Developer
Staff member
Nifft said:
Since the once-a-day pull item Bees issue was fixed to help the Pull All people not get those errors, this seemed similiar enough in scope that it was worth asking about.
Click to expand...
That's a fair point. I suppose that when we choose an item to auto-switch to, if it's a B item and you are in Beecore, we could just reject it. Unfortunately, there's no easy way to say "go find another item instead"; the function which chooses a "good" item is shared with the familiar trainer, and there is no reason to reject a B item in Beecore in the familiar trainer.
 
Veracity

Veracity

Developer
Staff member
Revision 9544 does that: if KoLmafia wants to equip a "good" item on a naked familiar, if you are in Beecore, it will reject the item if it is a B item.
 
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