Hi Mein Script

[GhettoTrucker]

Hi,
i recently started learning how to script with KolMafia so i'm not all that good yet, but i started thinking of a new prodject; A Hi Mein script. The way i picture the script working would be like login 3 players at a time ((1) lvl 15+ sauce (1)lvl 15+ pasta (1) lvl 15+SC or TT) and then retrieve the daily alotment of the lvl 15 item conjoure skill (for sauce and pasta) and then the Turtle tamer or Seal clubber would farm The Malus of Forethought for nuggets. Then the script would make all the hi meins possible with the ingredients farmed. But i'm not sure where to start...Any ideas?

[Nightmist]

If its one script logging in on all 3 of those characters and they all interact its a argueable point that it would be multi-abuse. (Unless like in the end they all got the same share of hi-mein, although then its still argueable that you shouldnt be interacting with your own characters at all.)

Thats just my opinion though

[efilnikufecin]

you will need a separate script for each character...well you could do it all in one, but it would be a lot easier with a separate script.

I can't say wether what you are wanting would be multi abuse or not because I don't know your intentions.

This thread contains some info you might find usefull for your endeavor. http://kolmafia.us/index.php/topic,119.0.html

[Sako]

If this was considered multi abuse, Jick wouldn't have made a food that needed 3 different classes to be made. >_>

The idea is interesting, 3 scripts that wait each other to create the stuff, then send the result and cook. I'd work on it if I had a 15+ pastamancer ;)

[Nightmist]

If this was considered multi abuse, Jick wouldn't have made a food that needed 3 different classes to be made. >_>

You mean 1 ascended class that doesnt mind smashing high level equips for nuggets. (Player co-operation isnt needed, it just makes getting the nuggets easier >>, assuming you already permed level 15 skills and are the right sign.)

I mean the script itself wouldnt be too hard if your just sending end products to a single person (Stick a while loop with a inv refresh and whenever it picks upa item, do whatever with it and send off to the person.)
Thats for a always online making bot anyway but its probably easier to do a login//logout script... (Since a always online bot is redundant if your going to script them all together anyway)


Well my opinion probably seems harsh but if your logging in 3 different characters in a script its most likely your own characters (Heh well even if they are not you are controlling them)... and if they are interacting thats effectively multi's//main interacting... which I have noted seems to be frowned upon by the people in the forums (KoL forums) but multi czar doesnt appear to make any statements on most of the "is this multi abuse" threads in there so...



Spoilery Explanation//Ranting:
I just got to say, if you do script this make sure they get a "fair" share of the output, so factor in that the pulverising person is using up equipment and so needs to be paid for that... and the PM needs to buy MSG so needs to be paid for that, dont forget the catalyst needs to be paid for too. Well you get the idea, its a semi-dodgy thing scripting interaction between characters which dont have "easily calculated" fair shares of the output.

[Sako]

You mean 1 ascended class that doesnt mind smashing high level equips for nuggets. (Player co-operation isnt needed, it just makes getting the nuggets easier >>, assuming you already permed level 15 skills and are the right sign.)
Actually, you need access to all 3 guilds, so just a single character won't do.
But yeah, a fair share is subtle to calculate, since Smashing requires equipment, the Wok needs 1000 meat + 1 adventure per piece, and the Way of sauce only needs 1000 meat, I think (haven't got a sauceror at the moment to try it out).

[Nightmist]

Actually, you need access to all 3 guilds, so just a single character won't do.
Hows so? Im only currently able to think of the myst shop items that "need" a guild since nuggets are obtainable without the malus.

[Presto Ragu]

Actually, I think you just need one character with the level 15 Sauceror skill, and the Level 15 SC skill that is currently a level 15 (or higher) PM.

Way of the sauce does not require the guild at all, except to acquire the catalyst, which you can do as a PM.

And from what I have read, you do not need access to the SC guild to pulverise... You may need it to "upgrade" you results to what you want... I haven't messed with it at all.


Sort of beaten by Nightmist... But not completely, so I post the responce unedited.

[GhettoTrucker]

Actually the initial idea for this script came about when i was talking witha few of my RL friends. (1) is a PM (1) is a Sauce and (1) is an SC. They were all talking about how they could make easy meat if they all worked togather and split the proffit. Then since i was obviastly out of the loop as far as getting any meat from this endevor i said (since i'm the smart programmer one), "If i write a script for KolMafia can i get 10% of the profits per sale?" So they agreed. I hadn't even thought about this could be used for multi abuse until now. So if i do decide to go through with it could you all help me out? But i think i probably won't publish it (atleast not for free.... ::) ) LOL....Anyway any help would be appreciated still.

[efilnikufecin]

If this was considered multi abuse, Jick wouldn't have made a food that needed 3 different classes to be made. >_>


That's definitely not my take on it. Jick set things up the way he did to promote player cooperation. ya know I'm a level 15+ seal clubber, you a pastamancer, and Joe Bloe is a sauceror. The 3 cooperate to create the item. Look at the description of the Pastamancer/sauceror character class.



Actually the initial idea for this script came about when i was talking witha few of my RL friends. (1) is a PM (1) is a Sauce and (1) is an SC. They were all talking about how they could make easy meat if they all worked togather and split the proffit. Then since i was obviastly out of the loop as far as getting any meat from this endevor i said (since i'm the smart programmer one), "If i write a script for KolMafia can i get 10% of the profits per sale?" So they agreed. I hadn't even thought about this could be used for multi abuse until now. So if i do decide to go through with it could you all help me out? But i think i probably won't publish it (atleast not for free.... ::) ) LOL....Anyway any help would be appreciated still.


so what you need is 3 seperate scripts. one for each class. In all actuality, the script would probably be best as a manual run script which would be run once the player saw that the items had arrived. Not a complex script at all there. I believe each one could be as simple as having only 1 line. The create line.

[GhettoTrucker]

Jick set things up the way he did to promote player cooperation.

Thats exactly the reason for this script. Some players (like myself) are more interested in making meat so they just run thier adventures in the clan gym. This script will simply do the "dirty"work of loging in 3 different players
(3 of my FRIENDS) so that you can enjoy meat making...

On another note i think i figured out the logging in 3 different players part. I think i will set it up to log them in one at a time then send them to the "cook." The "cook" will login last and the other 2 will send thier part to him. Once he is done getting his share of the items, he'll cook them up and send the share od hi meins to the other 2 player.

So far the tricky part i think will be writing the part of cooking them and sending them. How do you tell the bot/player if you don;t have enough of X to make Y try making Z? Also how would you write the part that says like if you make 3 hi meins send 1 to each. But obviastly thier isn't gonna be just 3 they'll be atleast 4-5.... I dunno. that part might have to be manual, or does anyone know of kinda of the "max" amount possible to make per day?

Merged



I believe each one could be as simple as having only 1 line. The create line.


So you think i should make a Hi Mein Create script with a Pastamancer script a Sauceror script and a Turtle Tamer/Seal Clubber script? Each would just have a "create" line that would say like
create [#] <itemname>
Does that "create" command work with getting the "skill" items (reagent, noodles, etc...)???

[efilnikufecin]

use item_amount to check to see how many you have of each item.

int A;
A = item_amount($item[itemtosend]) / 3;
cli_execute("send " + A + " " + $item[itemtosend] + "to whoever" );

before creating anything, you should of course closet the item you are about to create so that yesterdays items doesn't get included in the divide.



Does that "create" command work with getting the "skill" items (reagent, noodles, etc...)???
yes.

[GhettoTrucker]

Why do i have to closet the other items?

[efilnikufecin]

It's easier in a script to simply closet what you have, make what you can, then split what you now have between the 3 characters. The alternate option is to calculate how many was made.

Say the cook account has 3 hi meins already, then makes 5. Closeting the 3 first, the 5 would be split up, each would get 1, and 2 would be left. if you don't closet them then it could work out unintentionally that each get 2 with 2 left because the 3 the cook already had would be included in the split.

[GhettoTrucker]

oh ok. i see. umm...ok so in basic writing i would say:

Sauce script:
Closet All Items
Conjoure Scruptiouse reagents
send reagents to Pastamnacer


Pasta script:
Closet ALL items
Buy delectable catalyst from class guild
Use delectable catalyst
Send all scrumdiddlyumptious solutions to Seal clubber or Turtle Tamer

Seal/Turtle Script: (this is the tricky one for me...)
Could someone post in the same format as i posted the otehr how to get different nuggets? I'm a bit unsure on that one.

[holatuwol]

This sounds too much like multi-abuse.

[cjswimmer]

Why was the Hi Mein script topic locked and by whom was it locked?

I don't think the debate was finished. I personally do not feel that this is multi abuse at all if the resulting hi meins are being distributed between the contributing parties and I would be happy to help with this script outside of this forum. Its a pity that the discussion couldn't be continued here, but I'll wait to see what the reason was for the lock before I comment further.

[Nightmist]

I assume it was locked because holatuwol himself commented about it seeming like abuse. Although blind guesses are not usually the most accurate so ill have to leave it to someone else to make a solid comment on it.

Fear the below paragraphed rant of ranty-ness:

Ranty-Semi-On-Topic-Rant-Mostly-On-Multi's
The way I look at it is yes a hi-mein script would be fine BUT that is assuming the hi-mein script doesn't login on different characters and then proceeds to interact between those characters. As in my opinion by logging in 3 different characters it is effectively a multi//main interaction situation due to you having control over the characters. (So even if they are not "your" characters by logging in as them you are accepting you can use them as if they are yours and are therefore multi's)

When you say "contributing parties" the script that was being discussed in that thread was using 3 different characters in the same script (and also failed to explain a method of "fair distribution"). This effectively makes the "contributing parties" a single person but even when distributed between characters evenly//fairly it is possible to look upon as multi-abuse due to the "guarantee" of the goods being delivered rather then if done through a community path then the "risk" of not being able to find someone to do this or some other problem.


Heh well thats just my rant xD, most people will probably have vastly different opinions so *shrugs* Oh well.

[efilnikufecin]

As Holatuwol said, "This sounds too much like multi abuse".

Several of us are capable of making kolmafia do exactly what was wanted, and it would take longer to save all the passwords than to write up the needed files. I'm guessing the thread was intentionally stopped before the answer was given.

[GhettoTrucker]

That is also my guess. Even though i am the one who started the thread and the one with the initial idea, i too am starting to side with the fact that this can and definately will be used for multi abuse if released to the public. My initial idea was to use this so that i could help out my non programmer friends out, but yes, i too believe that it WILL used for multi abuse if this script gets into the wrong hands.

[holatuwol]

I personally do not feel that this is multi abuse at all if the resulting hi meins are being distributed between the contributing parties and I would be happy to help with this script outside of this forum.

Well, I locked the thread (in case it wasn't obvious from the previous replies).* The reasoning I used was basically decomposing the script into its component pieces and predict the likely direction of any further "debate" on the matter.* I approached it from a cost-benefit perspective, with the assumption that, because they're friends, they want to be completely fair to one another.


Seal Clubber
- hot nuggets: 900 meat

Sauceror
- delectable catalyst: 1000 meat
- scrumptious reagent: 2400 meat

Pastamancer
- MSG: 1000 meat
- dry noodles: 3000 meat

End Product
- hot hi mein: 9800 meat => 1500 profit
- 5 hot hi mein: 49000 meat => 7500 profit total
- 10% of 7500 => 750 meat per day


So we have a situation where one player (the seal clubber) is clearly getting a disproportionate share relative to the other two.* If you divide it more fairly (sauceror and pastamancer get two, seal clubber gets one), it's still biased in favor of the seal clubber -- seal clubber gets one hi mein for 1800 meat and the pastamancer and sauceror get two hi mein for 7000 meat. In more simple terms, the person doing the least amount of work gets the most benefit.

So how to remedy the problem?* One person sells it all and splits the profit between the friends, which yields a comfortable 2150 meat profit over just selling your items directly.* But, there's one catch: the script that does this runs from a single computer.* I don't know about you, but if you're trying to be fair, every part of the resulting transaction looks like multi abuse until the moment the seal clubber and sauceror receive their share.* Which is to say, 95% of this will look like multi-abuse from any log analyzers that are being tossed at you.

The script requestor -- GheTToTrucker (#633667) -- is a level 9 disco bandit with a 20 pound leprechaun sitting in their terrarium.* If there was truly any concern for 750 meat profit per day for very little effort, all it would take is to write a script to bring that familiar out of the terrarium and visit the laboratory for 3 adventures.* Therefore, I will accept that the only motivation behind this script is, "I want to help out my friends!"* Unfortunately, chances are this script will get all your friends disabled for multi-abuse, and that's not exactly helping them.* The only real reason to use it outside of this context is also for multi-abuse reasons, so I see no reason to continue its development.

[holatuwol]

I've merged the topics and unlocked them. You're more than welcome to continue the discussion and/or debate here if you'd like, but I have no further contributions to make.

[cjswimmer]

What if this script was used to create hi-meins for a clan's stash and not for personal sale? Is there a way to get one of the game admins to confirm that this indeed would be considered abuse?

[GhettoTrucker]

Actually you just might get an o.k from the Admins over at KOL. Many clans do such things such as farm for items put 'em in a stash and when they have thier HUGE clan givaways they aren't at any loss and everyone benefits. And usually as long as you get an ok from #6, and noody does something stupid (like raiding the stash) and selling the stuff for personal gain it shoud be good. I'm currently undecided about sontinuing the development of this script but it definately won;t get released to the public unless the Admin here at kolmafia.us ok's it.

[holatuwol]

What if this script was used to create hi-meins for a clan's stash and not for personal sale? Is there a way to get one of the game admins to confirm that this indeed would be considered abuse?

The problem with this script, as it's requested, is that it's all done from one computer, and the characters involved all interact with each other. Therefore, even if the script dropped the result in the clan stash, even if the items went through the clan stash instead of through kmail, it would be multi-abuse. People have been disabled before when they used the clan stash to interact with themselves while on the same computer; there's no precedent for sparing you when you utilize the stash as a bypass.